Clint:
Welcome to the Wedding Ceremony Podcast. This is episode number four recorded on Tuesday, February 25. I'm Clint Hufft. With me, as always, JP Reynolds. Today, I think based on what we just got done talking about were going to discuss when two people come together to get married but they’re from completely different backgrounds. How do we handle that? People look to us as the officiant to help them construct a ceremony or solve issues. JP, you just told me a story because of a wedding that you just a weekend. You said something that I thought was really cool. That it caught you by surprise. Tell me a little bit about, let us in on that story.
JP:
Good to be with you again, Clint, as always. I think it’s good for people to remember that you and I are based in Southern California. Here in Southern California, this is a very culturally diverse part of the world.
Clint:
Did you know there's more Spanish speaking people who call Spanish their native language in Los Angeles then there is in any other city in North or South America except for Mexico City?
JP:
Wow. That I did not know.
Clint:
Well, it may not be true. But I heard that.
JP:
It’s interesting on just the array of cultural traditions regarding the wedding. So what I find very endearing, for instance for Chinese tradition and it didn't take me by surprise is that for Chinese culturally they will be a little bit more reserved in the display of their emotions. But, in the ceremony during the procession, when people walk down the aisle, everybody gets around of applause. When I welcome everybody they give a round of applause. When I offer some words of good cheer and encouragement to the couple I get a round of applause. The first time it totally threw me off because I had not be aware of this tradition. As time goes on, as you know, and I know you have stories, it’s these cultural sensitivities in these cultural traditions that people bring to a wedding ceremony. You and I need to be very much aware of and help couples integrate into the ceremony.
Clint:
Part of that, I think maybe we talked on last week, where you say to the couple is there anything, what you call reality show drama? I say is there anybody giving you any grief? On the more positive side of that question is, when they say they come from different backgrounds, is there anything that is really important to the people in your family, that you want included the ceremony? Quite honestly there are certain parts of what we do when we go in blind because we’re not familiar with the culture.
JP:
It’s also interesting because most of the couples who come to you, come to me, there are couples who are not actively engaged in the religion of their parents. They might have grown up in a particular denomination, a particular faith, tradition, but they now identify more closely as being “spiritual”. So not only is it a challenge for you and me but oftentimes I ask a couple now is there anything from your culture, from your faith, traditions you’d like to incorporate? They look at me and smile “I’ll have to ask my mother – my grandmother”. So even the couple often times is not aware of those traditions.
Clint:
In fact when somebody comes and says we like to include this particular ritual, I think we need to distinguish the difference between religious upbringing and cultural upbringing. What I've discovered is that people can say they’re from a particular religion but what they'd want to do during the ceremony is very much regionally based.
JP:
Very much, yes. My background is Roman Catholic. Catholics, particularly from Mexico, who have any exposure to Spanish Catholic Church. They have very particular wedding traditions that you’re not going to find in a Bronx Irish Catholic wedding.
Clint:
Right. The Filipinos have specific traditions with the sponsors and all that kind of stuff. But they all still consider themselves part of the Roman Catholic community.
JP:
All part of the community. It’s just these days it’s interesting in the Philippines because the Catholic was the Spanish Catholic missionaries who went to the Philippines. So Filipinos are very much influenced in the tradition of the Spanish church.
Clint:
Was it the Spanish church that, because California has that heritage is well, yes? It was Spanish monks that came in and incorporated Christianity into the settlements. Is that right or wrong?
In the settlement of California when the Franciscan monks that came over?
JP:
Yes.
Clint:
I wonder if there any other Catholic communities that took it upon themselves to travel the world and and do missionary work.
JP:
Oh yeah. The European countries were very big on missionary work. Catholic missionaries went where the government went to colonize. The missionaries followed the armies and the conquerors.
Clint:
Does that mean, like Vietnam I think was a French colony. Does that mean the missionaries went in there from France?
JP:
The Vietnamese Catholics were converted by the French missionaries.
Clint:
When people come together from different traditions or cultures and they say I want to include this particular ritual. Then I say is that because of somebody in your family? Why? It’s all good if you want it’s fine but, why? Usually there somebody that they want to make happy. My approach is, alright, go to that person and find out exactly what they think this ritual is supposed to be. Because we want to do it exactly right from their criteria, so everybody’s happy.
JP:
Exactly. The great religious traditions of the world share what I call a symbolic vocabulary. Within Christianity, Judaism and Islam, these images of blessing involve the tying of knots and the draping of the veil. Light, smell and flowers and incense. The symbols are pretty much universal. How they are enacted in the ceremonies becomes particular to the faith tradition. For instance, this past summer the bride was ethnically Armenian, by religion Greek Orthodox and the groom was Persian Muslim. Now that’s heavy duty. It was 250 guests. To their credit, both families embraced the couple. There was no reality show drama. The couple wanted to honor the traditions of their families without being heavy duty religious. How do you do that? What we had to sift through was where are some of the signature moments in each of these ceremonies? Where do they ritualistically overlap? As you know, with the Persian ceremony there is something known as the sofra table. So we decided to have a very brief segment within the ceremony that was conducted by the groom's cousin, because he speaks Farsi. In the Greek Orthodox tradition it's the priest who crowns. The bride and groom have a crown. The priest crowns them and it’s the symbol of God's blessing for them. What I do was I invited the mothers to place the crown on the heads of their children. So it’s always a sense of how do you take an ancient tradition, honor that tradition, but give it a contemporary interpretation? People were just very moved. The Greek Orthodox side loved that they had the crowns, so they were happy. The Persian Muslim side was moved by the sight of mothers symbolically blessing their children.
Clint:
I love that kind of stuff. Where you incorporate people. That's one of the challenges that are in the minds of the bride and groom. We have this person that’s special to us. This person that we feel obligated to. That person's kid. I always say build the ceremony. Don't worry about anybody else. Build the ceremony. Figure out what you want to say to each other. There's so many ways that we can incorporate people and give them their moment in the sun and let them feel significant. Too often they'll come to me and say well, we want this person to do a reading. My criteria for the reading process is: number one, do they really want to do it? Who is this person? Are they relevant to you? But, more important than anything else, are they going to be cool getting up and speaking? All the statistics say public speaking is the number one phobia. So make sure they're cool with that. Make sure. Because the whole idea is that if the main focus of the groom is that the bride is blissfully happy. Then we want to make sure that the bride isn’t worried about anyone else. I'll give you another example: kids. If it's a child from a previous marriage and now were going to be incorporating them into this new family with a new mom or a new dad, stepdad, whatever, then I always go back to the personality of the kid. You know this kid way better than I do. We can acknowledge the child in their seats so they don’t feel like they have to stand up in front of everybody. Or we can bring them up. Hugs and kisses and maybe they get a gift. But it's all about the personalities involved and making sure that they all feel really really comfortable within the context of however you want to honor them.
JP:
Clint, you just said the word I emphasized with a couple and it’s the word, “comfort”. Comfortableness. I always say to people: no one, no one should ever have to do anything that makes them uncomfortable. That really is partly guiding principle. Tell me what you want. Tell me what you want included and why you want it included. We can figure out how to seamlessly weave it into the ceremony.
Clint:
There are some couples that will say, “Well, I’m getting married so they're obligated. They have to do this it.” Like if the couple decides to do a destination wedding and it's going to cost everybody a lot of money to go to this wedding. But they just think, “Well, everybody’s obligated to come to my wedding. Aren’t they? They’re supposed to come. So dig deep. Let’s go.” Or, if they do a wedding on a weekday. Now, if you're planning your budget, obviously you plan on a weekday to get married you’re going to save a ton of money. But, taking everybody else into consideration, what they have to do in order to attend your wedding. If it's on a Saturday or Sunday and they have a Monday to Friday 9-5 that's pretty simple for them. Even if they have to fly in. That’s pretty simple. But, if it's during the week, then they have to take time off from work. They have the extra expense. If you have somebody that's you expect to be in your wedding party. What are their expenses? They have to rent a tuxedo? Do they have to pay for the bridesmaids dress? That whole mentality carries through not only the wedding day and the preparation of the day but the ceremony especially. Because, as we've said in previous episodes, that little sliver of time which is the wedding ceremony, in the middle of a really big long day - which could end up being, from the time she starts hair and make up to the time they wave goodbye to everybody, ten to 12 hours - but have this little sliver of time. But the emotional content and the intensity can be so powerful. All the emotions are high.
JP:
The ceremony does play out almost entirely on emotional dimension. That's why all of these symbolic moments in the ceremony, these little touches, rituals that speak to the cultural and religious traditions of couple and their families. We want to have them speak on an emotional basis. Sometimes people give me a long explanation for a cultural tradition or religious tradition. Folks, this is not time for a PowerPoint presentation. Nobody wants a detailed history of whatever it might be. What it is is, it's that sense of all of these rituals from culture and religion speak to family and friends blessing the couple. I think our job, and what you and I do is, how do we streamline it and give a contemporary interpretation so that everybody visually and emotionally understands we are blessing this couple.
Clint:
And our role as officiant is kind of the master ceremonies. To guide everybody along. Like you said you brought up a cousin to speak in Farsi and explain the sofra. We may not be the person that actually says the whatever it is but we guide that process. To make everybody feel comfortable. I always say that we are part master of ceremonies when we begin to officiate a wedding ceremony. As a master of ceremonies, because I’ve done that my whole life, is we want to get from A to Z. We want to get from “Hi everybody. Thanks are coming.” To, “Have a good night.” In between our job is just to drive the ship. Make sure everything goes forward and everybody understands what’s happening. They feel included.
JP:
Yes. Absolutely. I think of myself as the host of that ceremony. I have host responsibilities. It’s just what you outlined.
Clint:
Here’s one of my favorite stories of the cultural differences. This couple, she was Filipino Catholic and he was Persian Muslim. They got married at this kind of cool hip nightclub in Los Angeles. They’re in that the room where the dancing takes place. They have a stage where the band normally stands. That's where we did the ceremony. That means they actually had seats around the room. Not fold up seats. In my memory they were actually almost like bleachers. Permanent seats that were around the side of the room. It was relatively intimate. It was a small club. They did something that I thought was really cool. Because it spoke to his heritage. We read some stuff from the Bible and we honored her Catholic heritage. Then we honored some stuff from him. But here's the the real twist. They did Vows. They did readings. They did rings. But they didn't say “I do” until the very end of the ceremony. They played it out like this: I turned to him and I said you want to marry her? In the right language. Do you want to marry her? He said yes. Okay, great. Then I turned to the bride and they told me the how this is gonna play out. The thing that half the guests didn't know because they were from the bride's family and culture. So they got caught by surprise. But his community, they were fired up and ready to go. So it goes like this. I turn to her and I say would you like to marry him and she says nothing. Then his side starts to kinda rumble a little bit. Like “Uh oh. Uh oh! She's not saying anything”. Again, the couple had prepared me for this. I look at her and I say a second time do you want to marry him? And she says nothing. Then his family and friends just unload on him. I mean, all in Farsi. I can’t understand a thing. They’re laughing and they’re saying, “She doesn’t want you! Oh, My God. What are you going to do?! Run!” They’re just letting it out and laughing and having a great time. He's just taking it. He’s gotta take his medicine. Then I asked her for a third time, do you want to marry him? She says, “I do”. And the place erupts and the party starts. That was the end of the ceremony. Because of the lighting I couldn't really see that deep into the guests face. But I know that one half of the room was really quiet and probably a little nervous. Then the celebration starts and it's all good.
JP:
Right, right. Now see, for those listening, that is a contemporary interpretation of the Persian tradition of where, I think, the groom goes to the house of the bride on the morning day. There's this ritual of asking three times. She, according to the ritual, plays very coy. Doesn't give him the answer. This was a very clever way of of giving new meaning to a very ancient tradition.
Clint:
Yeah it was really neat. I haven’t experienced it since. There was one couple where he was of Indian heritage from the country India. I don’t remember where she was from but traditional like a Protestant type of deal. She wanted to do a unity candle and they came up with this idea, which I thought was really cool. By the way, in certain cultures you not supposed to wear certain colors. Did you know that?
JP:Right.
Clint:
Everybody’s got to be sensitive to that. In the Hindu tradition the sacred fire is, I hope I pronounce this correctly, it's a AGNI. It’s a sacred fire. They decided they would make the unity candle the sacred fire and still do the unity candle. There’s a part of the Hindu tradition where the bride and groom circle around the sacred fire. It was awesome. Where they combine both things and they both lit the unity candle and then did the the Hindu traditions. It was very cool.
JP:
You know, Clint, that’s a beautiful example of what I'm saying earlier about how the great religious traditions share a symbolic vocabulary. How our responsibility is really to take these traditions, honor them, and create a way that gives it a contemporary personalized interpretation. But that families can look and say, “Ah, yes. Thank you.”
Clint:
That's where I think it's really important for wedding professionals to really listen and allow the couple to reveal their ceremony. Sometimes it happens organically from them. It’s a discovery process. I always begin every conversation: tell me what you want, tell me what you don't want. Just fill me in on all that. Half of them get caught by surprise. “I don’t know. I don’t know.” That’s okay. I don't want to put you on the spot. Every now and then somebody will say, “I’ll tell you what I don't want.” They'll give me a kind of a list of things. It's really fun when people get engaged then they go to their friend’s weddings. Their radar is out. They’re just inspecting. I hate that. I hate that. Ooh, I like that. I hate that. So they can incorporate or not incorporate that into their own wedding process. It's really hard for us as officiants to deal with our egos. Make sure that we allow the couple to express themselves. We guide them and we protect them. But that initial conversation, I think it's like 80% of the work .
JP:
That's very interesting. I would agree with you on that. Because certainly there are things I like. I have to especially, as you say, in that initial conversation, make sure that I know that I keep my preferences to myself. This is the couple’s ceremony. It’s not my ceremony. I want to make sure that people recognize the couple in their ceremony.
Clint:
Doesn’t that give you more joy? Because every ceremony we do is different. Because we allow the couple to be who they are and express themselves. I always say, listen, your marriage is one-of-a-kind. Nobody exactly like you has ever married somebody exactly like this other person. The ceremony should have that same kind of uniqueness to it. I always say, the officiants have the best in the house. To feel what's happening between these two people. And if it really is personal and unique to the two of them, it's the coolest thing for us as officiants. We’re so lucky. I tell people, if you ever get a chance to perform a wedding ceremony as an officiant, there's no going back. You get hooked.
JP:
It's very true, very true. In many respects, their wedding ceremony is one of the most intimate moments in their lives. The exchange of those Vows is one of the most intimate experiences that they will every have. I always consider it a great honor to just stand there and to bear witness. There's nothing like it.
Clint:
Well, we’ve reached the end of this episode. Boy, I tell ya, we’re so lucky. That we get to do what we do and help people the way we help people. Every time we say the same thing to each other. Whenever we stop the broadcast we always say, “Oh, my gosh. There is so much to talk about.”
JP:
When you say that we’re lucky, and we are, part of how we are lucky, Clint, is, you and I get to work with some of the most wonderful, generous and creative people anyone will ever find. Yet within the wedding industry is seeing you and I are very privileged and that we work with people who are at the top of their game. Floral designers and event planners and musicians and it's like, wow! We just work with really deep down good, generous people.
Clint:
Don't you love the experience, when you work with somebody who's kind of a novice, kind of entering the fray for maybe the first or second time. You can see that they’re a little frantic. There's the panic about the set in. You are able to say, No no. It’s all good. We’re going to be fine. Don't worry. It's fine.
JP:
Yes. Well, great, Clint. Onward and upward.
Clint:
Yet another one in the books. I want to thank everybody who's been listening. Remember, you're kind of in control of this. Because we really want to talk about what's important to you. So when you go to our website: WeddingCeremonyPodcast.com. The very first thing you'll see is the button which is “email us”. Let us know what you want to hear and we’ll address it as quickly as we possibly can. If you want us to come to your town and and share thoughts and help out a little bit, by all means let us know. We’re both professional speakers and we both like to help as many people as we possibly can. So keep that in mind as well. JP, thank you so much. Until next time.
JP:
Alright, Clint
Clint:
On behalf of JP Reynolds this is Clint we'll see you next time on the Wedding Ceremony Podcast.
Welcome to the Wedding Ceremony Podcast. This is episode number four recorded on Tuesday, February 25. I'm Clint Hufft. With me, as always, JP Reynolds. Today, I think based on what we just got done talking about were going to discuss when two people come together to get married but they’re from completely different backgrounds. How do we handle that? People look to us as the officiant to help them construct a ceremony or solve issues. JP, you just told me a story because of a wedding that you just a weekend. You said something that I thought was really cool. That it caught you by surprise. Tell me a little bit about, let us in on that story.
JP:
Good to be with you again, Clint, as always. I think it’s good for people to remember that you and I are based in Southern California. Here in Southern California, this is a very culturally diverse part of the world.
Clint:
Did you know there's more Spanish speaking people who call Spanish their native language in Los Angeles then there is in any other city in North or South America except for Mexico City?
JP:
Wow. That I did not know.
Clint:
Well, it may not be true. But I heard that.
JP:
It’s interesting on just the array of cultural traditions regarding the wedding. So what I find very endearing, for instance for Chinese tradition and it didn't take me by surprise is that for Chinese culturally they will be a little bit more reserved in the display of their emotions. But, in the ceremony during the procession, when people walk down the aisle, everybody gets around of applause. When I welcome everybody they give a round of applause. When I offer some words of good cheer and encouragement to the couple I get a round of applause. The first time it totally threw me off because I had not be aware of this tradition. As time goes on, as you know, and I know you have stories, it’s these cultural sensitivities in these cultural traditions that people bring to a wedding ceremony. You and I need to be very much aware of and help couples integrate into the ceremony.
Clint:
Part of that, I think maybe we talked on last week, where you say to the couple is there anything, what you call reality show drama? I say is there anybody giving you any grief? On the more positive side of that question is, when they say they come from different backgrounds, is there anything that is really important to the people in your family, that you want included the ceremony? Quite honestly there are certain parts of what we do when we go in blind because we’re not familiar with the culture.
JP:
It’s also interesting because most of the couples who come to you, come to me, there are couples who are not actively engaged in the religion of their parents. They might have grown up in a particular denomination, a particular faith, tradition, but they now identify more closely as being “spiritual”. So not only is it a challenge for you and me but oftentimes I ask a couple now is there anything from your culture, from your faith, traditions you’d like to incorporate? They look at me and smile “I’ll have to ask my mother – my grandmother”. So even the couple often times is not aware of those traditions.
Clint:
In fact when somebody comes and says we like to include this particular ritual, I think we need to distinguish the difference between religious upbringing and cultural upbringing. What I've discovered is that people can say they’re from a particular religion but what they'd want to do during the ceremony is very much regionally based.
JP:
Very much, yes. My background is Roman Catholic. Catholics, particularly from Mexico, who have any exposure to Spanish Catholic Church. They have very particular wedding traditions that you’re not going to find in a Bronx Irish Catholic wedding.
Clint:
Right. The Filipinos have specific traditions with the sponsors and all that kind of stuff. But they all still consider themselves part of the Roman Catholic community.
JP:
All part of the community. It’s just these days it’s interesting in the Philippines because the Catholic was the Spanish Catholic missionaries who went to the Philippines. So Filipinos are very much influenced in the tradition of the Spanish church.
Clint:
Was it the Spanish church that, because California has that heritage is well, yes? It was Spanish monks that came in and incorporated Christianity into the settlements. Is that right or wrong?
In the settlement of California when the Franciscan monks that came over?
JP:
Yes.
Clint:
I wonder if there any other Catholic communities that took it upon themselves to travel the world and and do missionary work.
JP:
Oh yeah. The European countries were very big on missionary work. Catholic missionaries went where the government went to colonize. The missionaries followed the armies and the conquerors.
Clint:
Does that mean, like Vietnam I think was a French colony. Does that mean the missionaries went in there from France?
JP:
The Vietnamese Catholics were converted by the French missionaries.
Clint:
When people come together from different traditions or cultures and they say I want to include this particular ritual. Then I say is that because of somebody in your family? Why? It’s all good if you want it’s fine but, why? Usually there somebody that they want to make happy. My approach is, alright, go to that person and find out exactly what they think this ritual is supposed to be. Because we want to do it exactly right from their criteria, so everybody’s happy.
JP:
Exactly. The great religious traditions of the world share what I call a symbolic vocabulary. Within Christianity, Judaism and Islam, these images of blessing involve the tying of knots and the draping of the veil. Light, smell and flowers and incense. The symbols are pretty much universal. How they are enacted in the ceremonies becomes particular to the faith tradition. For instance, this past summer the bride was ethnically Armenian, by religion Greek Orthodox and the groom was Persian Muslim. Now that’s heavy duty. It was 250 guests. To their credit, both families embraced the couple. There was no reality show drama. The couple wanted to honor the traditions of their families without being heavy duty religious. How do you do that? What we had to sift through was where are some of the signature moments in each of these ceremonies? Where do they ritualistically overlap? As you know, with the Persian ceremony there is something known as the sofra table. So we decided to have a very brief segment within the ceremony that was conducted by the groom's cousin, because he speaks Farsi. In the Greek Orthodox tradition it's the priest who crowns. The bride and groom have a crown. The priest crowns them and it’s the symbol of God's blessing for them. What I do was I invited the mothers to place the crown on the heads of their children. So it’s always a sense of how do you take an ancient tradition, honor that tradition, but give it a contemporary interpretation? People were just very moved. The Greek Orthodox side loved that they had the crowns, so they were happy. The Persian Muslim side was moved by the sight of mothers symbolically blessing their children.
Clint:
I love that kind of stuff. Where you incorporate people. That's one of the challenges that are in the minds of the bride and groom. We have this person that’s special to us. This person that we feel obligated to. That person's kid. I always say build the ceremony. Don't worry about anybody else. Build the ceremony. Figure out what you want to say to each other. There's so many ways that we can incorporate people and give them their moment in the sun and let them feel significant. Too often they'll come to me and say well, we want this person to do a reading. My criteria for the reading process is: number one, do they really want to do it? Who is this person? Are they relevant to you? But, more important than anything else, are they going to be cool getting up and speaking? All the statistics say public speaking is the number one phobia. So make sure they're cool with that. Make sure. Because the whole idea is that if the main focus of the groom is that the bride is blissfully happy. Then we want to make sure that the bride isn’t worried about anyone else. I'll give you another example: kids. If it's a child from a previous marriage and now were going to be incorporating them into this new family with a new mom or a new dad, stepdad, whatever, then I always go back to the personality of the kid. You know this kid way better than I do. We can acknowledge the child in their seats so they don’t feel like they have to stand up in front of everybody. Or we can bring them up. Hugs and kisses and maybe they get a gift. But it's all about the personalities involved and making sure that they all feel really really comfortable within the context of however you want to honor them.
JP:
Clint, you just said the word I emphasized with a couple and it’s the word, “comfort”. Comfortableness. I always say to people: no one, no one should ever have to do anything that makes them uncomfortable. That really is partly guiding principle. Tell me what you want. Tell me what you want included and why you want it included. We can figure out how to seamlessly weave it into the ceremony.
Clint:
There are some couples that will say, “Well, I’m getting married so they're obligated. They have to do this it.” Like if the couple decides to do a destination wedding and it's going to cost everybody a lot of money to go to this wedding. But they just think, “Well, everybody’s obligated to come to my wedding. Aren’t they? They’re supposed to come. So dig deep. Let’s go.” Or, if they do a wedding on a weekday. Now, if you're planning your budget, obviously you plan on a weekday to get married you’re going to save a ton of money. But, taking everybody else into consideration, what they have to do in order to attend your wedding. If it's on a Saturday or Sunday and they have a Monday to Friday 9-5 that's pretty simple for them. Even if they have to fly in. That’s pretty simple. But, if it's during the week, then they have to take time off from work. They have the extra expense. If you have somebody that's you expect to be in your wedding party. What are their expenses? They have to rent a tuxedo? Do they have to pay for the bridesmaids dress? That whole mentality carries through not only the wedding day and the preparation of the day but the ceremony especially. Because, as we've said in previous episodes, that little sliver of time which is the wedding ceremony, in the middle of a really big long day - which could end up being, from the time she starts hair and make up to the time they wave goodbye to everybody, ten to 12 hours - but have this little sliver of time. But the emotional content and the intensity can be so powerful. All the emotions are high.
JP:
The ceremony does play out almost entirely on emotional dimension. That's why all of these symbolic moments in the ceremony, these little touches, rituals that speak to the cultural and religious traditions of couple and their families. We want to have them speak on an emotional basis. Sometimes people give me a long explanation for a cultural tradition or religious tradition. Folks, this is not time for a PowerPoint presentation. Nobody wants a detailed history of whatever it might be. What it is is, it's that sense of all of these rituals from culture and religion speak to family and friends blessing the couple. I think our job, and what you and I do is, how do we streamline it and give a contemporary interpretation so that everybody visually and emotionally understands we are blessing this couple.
Clint:
And our role as officiant is kind of the master ceremonies. To guide everybody along. Like you said you brought up a cousin to speak in Farsi and explain the sofra. We may not be the person that actually says the whatever it is but we guide that process. To make everybody feel comfortable. I always say that we are part master of ceremonies when we begin to officiate a wedding ceremony. As a master of ceremonies, because I’ve done that my whole life, is we want to get from A to Z. We want to get from “Hi everybody. Thanks are coming.” To, “Have a good night.” In between our job is just to drive the ship. Make sure everything goes forward and everybody understands what’s happening. They feel included.
JP:
Yes. Absolutely. I think of myself as the host of that ceremony. I have host responsibilities. It’s just what you outlined.
Clint:
Here’s one of my favorite stories of the cultural differences. This couple, she was Filipino Catholic and he was Persian Muslim. They got married at this kind of cool hip nightclub in Los Angeles. They’re in that the room where the dancing takes place. They have a stage where the band normally stands. That's where we did the ceremony. That means they actually had seats around the room. Not fold up seats. In my memory they were actually almost like bleachers. Permanent seats that were around the side of the room. It was relatively intimate. It was a small club. They did something that I thought was really cool. Because it spoke to his heritage. We read some stuff from the Bible and we honored her Catholic heritage. Then we honored some stuff from him. But here's the the real twist. They did Vows. They did readings. They did rings. But they didn't say “I do” until the very end of the ceremony. They played it out like this: I turned to him and I said you want to marry her? In the right language. Do you want to marry her? He said yes. Okay, great. Then I turned to the bride and they told me the how this is gonna play out. The thing that half the guests didn't know because they were from the bride's family and culture. So they got caught by surprise. But his community, they were fired up and ready to go. So it goes like this. I turn to her and I say would you like to marry him and she says nothing. Then his side starts to kinda rumble a little bit. Like “Uh oh. Uh oh! She's not saying anything”. Again, the couple had prepared me for this. I look at her and I say a second time do you want to marry him? And she says nothing. Then his family and friends just unload on him. I mean, all in Farsi. I can’t understand a thing. They’re laughing and they’re saying, “She doesn’t want you! Oh, My God. What are you going to do?! Run!” They’re just letting it out and laughing and having a great time. He's just taking it. He’s gotta take his medicine. Then I asked her for a third time, do you want to marry him? She says, “I do”. And the place erupts and the party starts. That was the end of the ceremony. Because of the lighting I couldn't really see that deep into the guests face. But I know that one half of the room was really quiet and probably a little nervous. Then the celebration starts and it's all good.
JP:
Right, right. Now see, for those listening, that is a contemporary interpretation of the Persian tradition of where, I think, the groom goes to the house of the bride on the morning day. There's this ritual of asking three times. She, according to the ritual, plays very coy. Doesn't give him the answer. This was a very clever way of of giving new meaning to a very ancient tradition.
Clint:
Yeah it was really neat. I haven’t experienced it since. There was one couple where he was of Indian heritage from the country India. I don’t remember where she was from but traditional like a Protestant type of deal. She wanted to do a unity candle and they came up with this idea, which I thought was really cool. By the way, in certain cultures you not supposed to wear certain colors. Did you know that?
JP:Right.
Clint:
Everybody’s got to be sensitive to that. In the Hindu tradition the sacred fire is, I hope I pronounce this correctly, it's a AGNI. It’s a sacred fire. They decided they would make the unity candle the sacred fire and still do the unity candle. There’s a part of the Hindu tradition where the bride and groom circle around the sacred fire. It was awesome. Where they combine both things and they both lit the unity candle and then did the the Hindu traditions. It was very cool.
JP:
You know, Clint, that’s a beautiful example of what I'm saying earlier about how the great religious traditions share a symbolic vocabulary. How our responsibility is really to take these traditions, honor them, and create a way that gives it a contemporary personalized interpretation. But that families can look and say, “Ah, yes. Thank you.”
Clint:
That's where I think it's really important for wedding professionals to really listen and allow the couple to reveal their ceremony. Sometimes it happens organically from them. It’s a discovery process. I always begin every conversation: tell me what you want, tell me what you don't want. Just fill me in on all that. Half of them get caught by surprise. “I don’t know. I don’t know.” That’s okay. I don't want to put you on the spot. Every now and then somebody will say, “I’ll tell you what I don't want.” They'll give me a kind of a list of things. It's really fun when people get engaged then they go to their friend’s weddings. Their radar is out. They’re just inspecting. I hate that. I hate that. Ooh, I like that. I hate that. So they can incorporate or not incorporate that into their own wedding process. It's really hard for us as officiants to deal with our egos. Make sure that we allow the couple to express themselves. We guide them and we protect them. But that initial conversation, I think it's like 80% of the work .
JP:
That's very interesting. I would agree with you on that. Because certainly there are things I like. I have to especially, as you say, in that initial conversation, make sure that I know that I keep my preferences to myself. This is the couple’s ceremony. It’s not my ceremony. I want to make sure that people recognize the couple in their ceremony.
Clint:
Doesn’t that give you more joy? Because every ceremony we do is different. Because we allow the couple to be who they are and express themselves. I always say, listen, your marriage is one-of-a-kind. Nobody exactly like you has ever married somebody exactly like this other person. The ceremony should have that same kind of uniqueness to it. I always say, the officiants have the best in the house. To feel what's happening between these two people. And if it really is personal and unique to the two of them, it's the coolest thing for us as officiants. We’re so lucky. I tell people, if you ever get a chance to perform a wedding ceremony as an officiant, there's no going back. You get hooked.
JP:
It's very true, very true. In many respects, their wedding ceremony is one of the most intimate moments in their lives. The exchange of those Vows is one of the most intimate experiences that they will every have. I always consider it a great honor to just stand there and to bear witness. There's nothing like it.
Clint:
Well, we’ve reached the end of this episode. Boy, I tell ya, we’re so lucky. That we get to do what we do and help people the way we help people. Every time we say the same thing to each other. Whenever we stop the broadcast we always say, “Oh, my gosh. There is so much to talk about.”
JP:
When you say that we’re lucky, and we are, part of how we are lucky, Clint, is, you and I get to work with some of the most wonderful, generous and creative people anyone will ever find. Yet within the wedding industry is seeing you and I are very privileged and that we work with people who are at the top of their game. Floral designers and event planners and musicians and it's like, wow! We just work with really deep down good, generous people.
Clint:
Don't you love the experience, when you work with somebody who's kind of a novice, kind of entering the fray for maybe the first or second time. You can see that they’re a little frantic. There's the panic about the set in. You are able to say, No no. It’s all good. We’re going to be fine. Don't worry. It's fine.
JP:
Yes. Well, great, Clint. Onward and upward.
Clint:
Yet another one in the books. I want to thank everybody who's been listening. Remember, you're kind of in control of this. Because we really want to talk about what's important to you. So when you go to our website: WeddingCeremonyPodcast.com. The very first thing you'll see is the button which is “email us”. Let us know what you want to hear and we’ll address it as quickly as we possibly can. If you want us to come to your town and and share thoughts and help out a little bit, by all means let us know. We’re both professional speakers and we both like to help as many people as we possibly can. So keep that in mind as well. JP, thank you so much. Until next time.
JP:
Alright, Clint
Clint:
On behalf of JP Reynolds this is Clint we'll see you next time on the Wedding Ceremony Podcast.